Enterable Variables in Output Form headers

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Enterable Variables in Output Form headers

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Mac
4D V16 R2

From the Design Reference on the subject of Output Forms I can find the following:  

   " The header and/or footer of the form may contain buttons, pop-up menus, etc."

   " You can customize output forms  by adding variables in the Header or Footer area."

I do not see an example or an explicit statement that enterable variables are allowed.


My problem is this. I want to add an enterable variable into the header of a Output Form. In my case as part of an interface to allow the user to customize (filter) the records that are displayed.

This works fine if the Output Form has been called up by MODIFY SELECTION.

However, if that same Output Form has been called up by DISPLAY SELECTION, it is no longer possible (in my experience) to enter text into the enterable variable of the header.

Some questions:

Is this true?

Is there a logical reason this is true?

Is this documented anywhere?

Is there a simple workaround?

*    *    *    *    *    *    *    *    *    *    *    *    *    

My workaround (for when I am using DISPLAY SELECTION instead of MODIFY SELECTION) is to have a button in the header that brings up a dialog window into which I can enter some text and use that to filter the listing. But this involves an extra step and seems peculiar because this workaround is not required for MODIFY SELECTION.

Can anyone shed light on this issue?
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Re: Enterable Variables in Output Form headers

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> Le 18 juin 2017 à 05:54, Robert Livingston via 4D_Tech <[hidden email]> a écrit :
>
> Mac
> 4D V16 R2
>
> From the Design Reference on the subject of Output Forms I can find the following:  
>
>   " The header and/or footer of the form may contain buttons, pop-up menus, etc."
>
>   " You can customize output forms  by adding variables in the Header or Footer area."
>
> I do not see an example or an explicit statement that enterable variables are allowed.
>
> [...]
>
> Can anyone shed light on this issue?

I could never obtain an enterable variable with DISPLAY/MODIFY SELECTION. Since I use selection listbox in a form opened by DIALOG, I can.

BTW, I think you should consider removing DISPLAY/MODIFY SELECTION, these are old commands that work less and less well. And DIALOG makes possible to remove ADD/MODIFY RECORD too. One command to open any form sounds better to me…

--
Arnaud




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Re: Enterable Variables in Output Form headers

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> On Jun 18, 2017, at 7:45 AM, Arnaud de Montard via 4D_Tech <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> I could never obtain an enterable variable with DISPLAY/MODIFY SELECTION. Since I use selection listbox in a form opened by DIALOG, I can.

Well, it works for me with MODIFY SELECTION just not DISPLAY SELECTION

>
> BTW, I think you should consider removing DISPLAY/MODIFY SELECTION, these are old commands that work less and less well. And DIALOG makes possible to remove ADD/MODIFY RECORD too. One command to open any form sounds better to me…

I do appreciate the advice. But it makes me feel that I am not one of the in crowd. I use DISPLAY/MODIFY SELECTION all day long! I have never seen anything from 4D that these commends were headed into the sunset. That these were "old commands".

 I am so invested in these commands on the current project that I am working on that I find it hard to conceive of changing all this. I feel that I am wearing a tie-dyed shirt and saddle shoes and just did not know that that was not done in 2017.

But your "equivalent" is to have a form with a LISTBOX that fills the available space and which has been filled by SELECTION TO ARRAY? And then (if you are trying to mimic DISPLAY SELECTION behavior) you double click on a row of that listbox and another form pops up which contains the single record? Is that how the cool crowd is doing things?

*    *    *    *    *    *    *    *    *    *    *    *    *    *    

The problem that I was trying to solve was to have an enterable variable in the header area of an output form being displayed with DISPLAY SELECTION. But you can't enter anything. The purpose of the enterable variable was  to enter text that would "filter" the selection when an adjacent button was clicked.

Anyway, my uber-kludge for my current project is to have an invisible button over the enterable variable in the header. When the user clicks on it to enter data, the invisible button calls up, with Open form window, a Dialog window that exactly matches the look of that portion of the header and it is placed in that exact location and contains an enterable variable and action button. The user can then enter data into the Dialog equivalent of what was on the header. When he clicks the adjacent button ( "cloned" in the Dialog window) the Dialog window is dismissed and the action carried out.

There are a few vague UI weirdness that accompanies this but it is not actually all that unsettling. I use a Modal Form Dialogue Box which essentially put the main window to sleep until the users proceeds with the filtering or cancels it all within the Dialog window. The user, after this Dialogue window is called up, cannot just forget the whole thing and go off and do something else because the main window is dead until the Modal Window is dismissed.

*    *    *    *    *    *    *    *    *    *    *    *    *    *

But I am curious and ask the assembled crowd. Has everyone basically given up on using DISPLAY/MODIFY SELECTION? The cool kids have moved on?
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Re: Enterable Variables in Output Form headers

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p.142 4D v11 SQL Upgrade Reference

ftp://ftp.4d.com//ACI_PRODUCT_REFERENCE_LIBRARY/4D_PRODUCT_DOCUMENTATION/PDF_Docs_by_4D_Product_A-Z/4D/4D_v11_SQL/4D_v11_Upgrade.pdf

section "Why Use Project Forms?"

quote:

Lastly, project forms can be used to create interfaces that comply with OS standards more easily. In particular, calling (via the DIALOG command ) project forms that display the selections of records in subforms is now recommended by 4D for the display of records in list form. With a little additional programming, this combination is an improvement on the MODIFY SELECTION and DISPLAY SELECTION commands.

> 2017/06/19 4:00、Robert Livingston via 4D_Tech <[hidden email]> のメール:
> I have never seen anything from 4D that these commends were headed into the sunset. That these were "old commands".




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Re: Enterable Variables in Output Form headers

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KM

Thanks a lot for your reply. I did a quick look over of the link that you sent and will study the material. Much appreciated.




> On Jun 18, 2017, at 3:22 PM, Keisuke Miyako via 4D_Tech <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> section "Why Use Project Forms?"
>
> quote:
>
> Lastly, project forms can be used to create interfaces that comply with OS standards more easily. In particular, calling (via the DIALOG command ) project forms that display the selections of records in subforms is now recommended by 4D for the display of records in list form. With a little additional programming, this combination is an improvement on the MODIFY SELECTION and DISPLAY SELECTION commands.

So this is 4D confirming what Arnaud was telling me. I am glad I have been directed to the correct track.

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Re: Enterable Variables in Output Form headers

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In reply to this post by 4D Tech mailing list
I think this idea will work for you.
use modify selection - set table in read only first
records are not editable
and the behavior you desire (enterable variable(s)) should be available.

as for Listboxes:
there are 2 types, array and selection based.
- an array listbox functions as you suggest (array to selection)
- selection based list box uses the current selection of the table
displaying whatever columns(fields) you have specified, and functions
much like display selection.

If you want - email me privately - I can send you a demo with code to
make list boxes work for you , generically.
The listbox (selection or array) get built on the fly from a single
project form.

Chip

On Sun, 18 Jun 2017 12:00:02 -0700, Robert Livingston via 4D_Tech wrote:

>
>> On Jun 18, 2017, at 7:45 AM, Arnaud de Montard via 4D_Tech
>> <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>> I could never obtain an enterable variable with DISPLAY/MODIFY
>> SELECTION. Since I use selection listbox in a form opened by DIALOG,
>> I can.
>
> Well, it works for me with MODIFY SELECTION just not DISPLAY SELECTION
>
>>
>> BTW, I think you should consider removing DISPLAY/MODIFY SELECTION,
>> these are old commands that work less and less well. And DIALOG
>> makes possible to remove ADD/MODIFY RECORD too. One command to open
>> any form sounds better to me…
>
> I do appreciate the advice. But it makes me feel that I am not one of
> the in crowd. I use DISPLAY/MODIFY SELECTION all day long! I have
> never seen anything from 4D that these commends were headed into the
> sunset. That these were "old commands".
>
>  I am so invested in these commands on the current project that I am
> working on that I find it hard to conceive of changing all this. I
> feel that I am wearing a tie-dyed shirt and saddle shoes and just did
> not know that that was not done in 2017.
>
> But your "equivalent" is to have a form with a LISTBOX that fills the
> available space and which has been filled by SELECTION TO ARRAY? And
> then (if you are trying to mimic DISPLAY SELECTION behavior) you
> double click on a row of that listbox and another form pops up which
> contains the single record? Is that how the cool crowd is doing
> things?
>
> *    *    *    *    *    *    *    *    *    *    *    *    *    *    
>
> The problem that I was trying to solve was to have an enterable
> variable in the header area of an output form being displayed with
> DISPLAY SELECTION. But you can't enter anything. The purpose of the
> enterable variable was  to enter text that would "filter" the
> selection when an adjacent button was clicked.
>
> Anyway, my uber-kludge for my current project is to have an invisible
> button over the enterable variable in the header. When the user
> clicks on it to enter data, the invisible button calls up, with Open
> form window, a Dialog window that exactly matches the look of that
> portion of the header and it is placed in that exact location and
> contains an enterable variable and action button. The user can then
> enter data into the Dialog equivalent of what was on the header. When
> he clicks the adjacent button ( "cloned" in the Dialog window) the
> Dialog window is dismissed and the action carried out.
>
> There are a few vague UI weirdness that accompanies this but it is
> not actually all that unsettling. I use a Modal Form Dialogue Box
> which essentially put the main window to sleep until the users
> proceeds with the filtering or cancels it all within the Dialog
> window. The user, after this Dialogue window is called up, cannot
> just forget the whole thing and go off and do something else because
> the main window is dead until the Modal Window is dismissed.
>
> *    *    *    *    *    *    *    *    *    *    *    *    *    *
>
> But I am curious and ask the assembled crowd. Has everyone basically
> given up on using DISPLAY/MODIFY SELECTION? The cool kids have moved
> on?
> **********************************************************************
> 4D Internet Users Group (4D iNUG)
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Re: Enterable Variables in Output Form headers

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Robert Livingston:

> But I am curious and ask the assembled crowd. Has everyone basically given up on using DISPLAY/MODIFY SELECTION? The cool kids have moved on?

Not sure if I´m a cool kid but I don´t use DISPLAY/MODIFY SELECTION anymore.
Selection based Listboxes are really comfortable.

Just my 2 Eurocent.

Greetings from Germany,
Bernd Fröhlich
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